New genre // New definition [just no]

everything else :P

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New genre // New definition [just no]

Post by askenase » Sun Apr 22, 2007 7:40 pm

I hope this is the right forum! when not, please displace it.

I request an new genre in anidb: Anime-like Cartoons

My "beta" definition for animelike Cartoons:

1. A Cartoons with the same drawing stlye like a standard japanese cartoon:
Big Eyes
Detailed background
but the humans or characters has simply drawed faces
realistic animation in the cartoon.
(examples for cartoons which has not this characteristics: Simpsons , sponde bob, spiderman, batman)

2. typical anime emotion expression of the characters. for example: ^^; -_- or realistic expression...
(examples for cartoons which has not this characteristics: Simsions, future rama, sponde bob)

3. realistic background: only cartoons with a bit realism should be gatherd under this genre. for example: When a character dies in a scence he must stay dead (examples for cartoons which has not this characteristics: tom & jerry or South park)

4. one big story not only short stories, or short stories with the same back ground like in Shinigami or japanese horro classic. (examples for cartoons which has not this characteristics: tom & jerry, duck tales)

"why should be such a genre in anidb, the definiton of animes is a japanese cartoon."

i posted some reasons in my old post. unfortunately it was deleted but i will list the importants one here.

1. In a time of globalization you can fix a defentions by locations of companies. For Example the BMG is a big sponsor of some animes. But the BMG is a German company. And Companies are profit lecherous association, which are acting all over the world. I think they dont have a real standard concept for animes, they just produce thing which are profitable.

2. This definition has some logical failures. When someone produce a big part of a cartoon in a foreign country but the last parts are finished in japan it is automaticly an anime.
Or when a Group of Japanese Animator, which produced in the past many animes, are now working on a cartoon for a foreign company, this cartoon will not be an anime.
Or when a foreign company (headquarter in a foreign country) produce an comic with satellite station in japan, this comic will not be an anime cause it was produced by a forgein company.
that all make no scence.

3. This def. holds an conflict in itself. Korean and Chinese Cartoons are allowed to gather in the anidb database! Why not other cartoons with the typical charactistc of an anime.

4. You dont need to be Japanese to make things which are made typically by japanese. This is the universal principle of learing and of intervention politics.

i hope my english is good enough to understand my sentense.
only subserving post not defaming ones, plz.

if a moderator delte this post he could at least send me a pm why he delted it.

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Post by Der Idiot » Sun Apr 22, 2007 7:46 pm

forget it

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Post by nwa » Sun Apr 22, 2007 7:52 pm

askenase wrote:4. one big story not only short stories
Well, that was your only sensible suggestion and it's already in...
Serial vs Episodic presentation

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Post by askenase » Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:12 pm

@nwa so why are the other one not sensible suggestions ?
@der idot: no comment

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Post by Der Idiot » Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:17 pm

can't you just kill yourself? there will never be avatar in anidb. end of story

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Post by Drizi » Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:36 pm

Your suggestion sound grea... err... no it doesn't... worst crap i have ever heard...

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Post by benu » Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:51 pm

/me points at askenase and laughs


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Post by ender » Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:59 pm

<- laughs with benu.
Here, some cookies.

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Post by askenase » Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:11 pm

@benu, ender, drizi
what a primitive rabble...
i never seen such bad boys like you... ohh no what should i do. Oh god pleas help me. zzzzzzzZZZZZZzzzzzzz
why dont you guys make a forum clan: Bad rapple gang up childs or guys with wasted lives...

@der idot
so kannst du mit deiner mutter labbern aber net mit mir. schiess dir selber in kopf wenn du ein problem mit welt hast aber geh mir net auf den sack... mit den kack spüchen punktest du vieleicht auf deiner hauptschule. primitves stück scheisse.

weil es mich bockt ob avatar nun auf anidb kommt oder net du arschkopf ich habe noch andere sachen im leben zu tun als du du forum hengst... die 1103 einträge beweisen ja das du arbeitslos oder dumm biost

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Post by sekoj » Mon Apr 23, 2007 10:25 am

benu a "bad boy" *giggle*
hmmmm those cookies look good.

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Post by Merlin » Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:58 pm

Interesting deformation of the beautiful German language ^^

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Post by egg » Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:40 am

The definition of anime is something that has been discussed many times in the past. The current definition is more or less what I wrote, and that was to match what the various mods opinions were at the time. Even between the mods there were disagreements as to what should be an anime, and this definition was a compromise between the various views the mods had. At the time questionable things were allowed by one anime only to be removed by another, so a common rule needed to be created. So after a lot of discussions and revisions we ended up with something that nobody objected to that much.

One of the first things that was thrown out was a style based definition, partially because it was it was difficult to quantify (and we needed clear guidelines) and partially it was felt that being related to Japan (or at least Asia) was an important component.

Now I don't think anybody is "happy" with the definition, but it is reasonable and enforceable (a key provision).

Now given that, maybe you can understand why the mods are not enthusiastic about the subject. You also have to understand that the mods are frequently have to deal with people who disagree with or are ignorant of the definition and have to repeatedly tell people why certain things (like Avatar) are not anime.

If you really want to change the definition, first you will have to let the mods settle down. Then you should get to know the mods in a non-confrontational way (well that's probably impossible, but don't antagonize them too much if you want something from them). Then you can probably talk about modifications to the existing rules, not necessarily a complete rewrite.

Just as a note for anybody who has a "great idea" for anidb, this post applies to you too. Remember the mods have to put up with a lot of crap and tend to be grumpy when you propose things they have to deal with repeatedly. Also a number of things have a long history that you may not be aware of, a lot of stuff happens on irc and you do not necessarily know about it if you just look in the forum. Finally, getting on the good side of the mods is also a good idea. If you are one of the people that they have to deal with that either does not properly document their sources and/or tries to do things like funny voting or adding unwanted shows as anime, it is probable the mods already have a grudge against you even before you make a post in the forum.

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Post by HiEv » Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:12 pm

If you want the simple explanation, you're asking to put non-anime material in an anime database. Is it any wonder it got so flatly rejected?

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Post by Hoerie » Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:45 pm

next we'll be having Kamen Rider, X-Bomber and the Power Rangers too...

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Post by Gambit » Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:27 pm

You are NOT, I repeat: NOT the one who decides what should be the sole definition of anime, or what kind of genres should be applied. No to mention that you try to redefine the policy of AniDB to whatever you want it to be. We have a community, we have mods, so you can probably understand that we have already discussed such things. Seeing someone redefining what took us months or years to agree on - how exactly do you think you look like to most people here? Exactly, an arrogant bastard who believes AniDB will apply everything you throw at it. So is it a wonder people react like you like this? Not really.

I haven`t seen your previous post, but all the points you use here all fit the above.