[ALL-REQs] Categories (new genre system)

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DonGato
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Post by DonGato » Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:50 pm

Well, I don't see any point to it.
We should add slurp and splash then. :P

Der Idiot
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Post by Der Idiot » Thu Jul 28, 2005 1:42 pm

no one objected so i merged day to day and real life into slice of life. makes more sense that way anyway. there is no need for somethign that says the same and is just different in the way of realism.

which brings me back to ::Realisic/Realism

that still needs to get implemented

Dynamic::Plot
Dynamic::Plot::Presentation::Epic
Dynamic::Plot::Presentation::Episodic
Dynamic::Plot::Situational Content::Realistic
Dynamic::Plot::Situational Content::Twisted

?!

Realism needs some sort of definition rather soonish in case of implementation as it's rather hard to define as the following discussion shows:

Code: Select all

[ 22:26:24 ]  [ @Ultima ] an alternate world in the anime can be "realistic" as well
[ 22:26:41 ]  [ @Wlah ] Ultima hmm..
[ 22:26:47 ]  [ @Wlah ] I can't really follow that
[ 22:27:41 ]  [ @Ultima ] <@Wlah> real life is a setting in a realistic world <-- what do you mean by "realistic"? A world that mirrors our own, or an alternative/fantasy world that feels realistic? or do you mean both?
[ 22:28:21 ]  [ @Wlah ] mirrors our own of course
[ 22:28:23 ]  [ @Wlah ] what else?
[ 22:28:33 ]  [ @Wlah ] for something to be realistic is when it mirrors the real world
[ 22:28:39 ]  [ @Wlah ] that's why it's 'real'istisc
[ 22:29:02 ]  [ @Wlah ] a realistic anime is piano
[ 22:29:14 ]  [ @Wlah ] a non-realistic anime is yumeria
[ 22:29:35 ]  [ @Ultima ] you mean something that mirrors our real world
[ 22:29:44 ]  [ @Wlah ] yes
[ 22:29:44 ]  [ @Ultima ] then what about juuni kokuki?
[ 22:29:47 ]  [ @Wlah ] I said that yeah
[ 22:30:11 ]  [ @Wlah ] havn't watched that, but parts of that are set in other worlds -> not realistic
[ 22:30:25 ]  [ @Wlah ] perhaps the world she starts in (ours) is realistic but the rest when she goes away is not
[ 22:30:35 ]  [ @Ultima ] it is an alternate world
[ 22:30:41 ]  [ @Wlah ] same for fushigiyuugi
[ 22:30:47 ]  [ @Ultima ] but the story itself strives to be realistic in it's own sense
:/

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DonGato
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Post by DonGato » Thu Jul 28, 2005 2:15 pm

An anime being "realistic" can be debatable.
I wouldn't use that classification.

Der Idiot
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Post by Der Idiot » Sun Aug 07, 2005 2:03 am

Dynamic::Plot
Dynamic::Plot::Presentation::Epic
Dynamic::Plot::Presentation::Episodic
Dynamic::Plot::Situational Content::Twisted


as again no one objected... I added that

aside of that epic is now serial.

i left out realism for the time being in hope for some discussion on that one

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Post by Der Idiot » Mon Aug 08, 2005 1:55 am

*kicks th thread once more*

can it really be no one feels the need to discuss things anymore?

TechNiko
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Post by TechNiko » Mon Aug 08, 2005 4:35 am

My ideas just get ignored or rejected so I'm reluctant to post here anymore. I still believe firlmy that there should be more meaningful subcategories in the Characters section, I'll go into more details.

-Characters
--Age
--| Children (0-9)
--| Teenagers (10-19)
--| Grownup (20-9999)
--| Indeterminable (??-??)

-Characters
--Gender
--| Male
--| Female
--| Other

-Characters
--Sexual Orientation (why is this still under hentai?)
--| Staight
--| Incest
--| Yaoi
--| Yuri
--| Pedophilia (for realllly young characters or young boys)
--| Lolicon (only for younger girls)
--| Bestiality (if there is any anime with it? Ebichu? =P)

Most appropriate usage:
+ Some characters but none important, or short flashbacks from the past. (of that gender/age/sexual orientation)
* One semi-to-important character.
*+ A few semi-to-important characters but not the majority.
** Important characters and/or alot of secondary characters.
**+ Every important characters (may have 1 exception)
*** Every important character or possibly the whole world but the main character or something like that.

Examples:
Mai-Hime: Children +, Teenagers ***, Female **+, Male *+, Straight **+, Yuri *
Berserk : Children +, Teenagers *, Grownup **+, Male **+, Female *, Straight **+, Pedophilia +, Yaoi +
(Doing this out of memory, I don't remember them well enough to be sure)

---------------

And also

-Characters
--Professions
---Organisations
---| Syndicate (bebop, gungrave, noir?...)
---| Secret (witch hunter robin, can't think of others atm...)
---| Governmental (saikano, fullmetal alchemist, gunsligner girl, witch hunter robin...)

-Setting
--Place
--| Underground

-Setting
--Place
---Building
---| School
----| Campus
----| Classrooms
----| Clubs

-Setting
--Place
--| Civilization
---| Kingdom
---| Country
---| Empire
---| Village
---| City
----| Streets
(possibly remove Dystopia from other-worlds and put it here instead)
Last edited by TechNiko on Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

Ultima
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Post by Ultima » Mon Aug 08, 2005 4:43 am

Well, first of all, if we are to apply the term "realism" to an anime's plot, we would have to determine upon what criteria or aspects to distinguish it from anime with a "non-realistic" plot.

If you were ask me, "Give me an example of a "realistic" anime." Naturally my instinctful reaction would be to think of an anime that tries to present, develop, and emulate situations of our reality. To keep things in perspective, all anime is fictional, but not surprisingly, many Ghibli films come to mind. Why? Because that's the primary goal of many Ghibli films - to be "realistic". While the plot may be based on fantasy or fiction, there is always something nostalgic about the characters and situations. These characters and situations feel nostalgic because of the "realistic" way situations unfold and how characters react to them.

In all anime that I consider "realistic", they all raise a specific question, "What would I do if I were a character in this situation?" Dr. Fidel Fajardo-Acosta's World Literature website defines realism as "a style in art and literature emphasizing the faithful representation of human life and social reality."

So far, it seems simple enough. However, the problem arises when it is not so obvious, particular when fantasy (i.e. magic) is involved. For example, Hikaru no Go. Hikaru no Go is about a boy who meets a master Go player and ends up becoming a very good Go player as a result. This takes place over the course of about 2-3 years (if I remember correctly). Is this realistic? You probably would get different answers from people. Why? Because although Hikaru does "grow up", that is probably not the main focus of the story. It focuses on how he matures as a Go player, not necessarily on his emotional development.

Let's take another anime, say Juuni Kokuki. If you asked whether this is a realistic anime, most probably would state it is. Why? Because of the characters and situations the characters face. Although, the setting is based on fantasy, the situations characters face and how they react is "realistic" to most people.

It is easy to classify most "entertaining" anime (i.e. comedy, harem, parody) as non-realistic because there is usually not much plot and development with characters.

So the question lies in, where do we draw the line when it comes to defining "realism" when it comes to the situational content (i.e. plot) of the anime? In pretty much all "realistic" anime to me, main characters' development is part of the main focus of the anime. Character development and plot usually go hand in hand. Should we limit "realistic" anime to anime depicting "reality" as we know it? If that's the case, any anime that has a fantasy/sci-fi-like plot will more than likely be excluded. However, if we were to include fantasy/sci-fi anime, it would be quite complicated because when characters are well developed due to the sheer number of episodes (like in shounen anime like dbz or Naruto). It can make the anime feel "realistic" merely because you know the character's personality so well. Does this make such anime realistic? It is true that no one can throw energy balls or blow up entire planets, but no one has ended up in an alternate Japan like in Juuni Kokuki yet that is considered "realistic".

TechNiko
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Post by TechNiko » Mon Aug 08, 2005 5:03 am

Just pitching ideas for realism, not very complete.

Though in this case it would be more appropriate if the weight + meant "none at all" since no entry at all could mean that that part has been ignored instead of denied.

-Realism
--| Characters
---| Personality
---| Body proportions
---| Reaction to situations

-Realism
--| Story
---| Completely possible
---| Scientifically possible
---| Impossible but plausible
---| Totally Impossible
OR
-Realism
--| Story
---| Credibility
---| Scientific Plausability


Edit: Also as suggested by Keitarou
-Characters
-| Otaku
-| (Computer) Nerd

pelican
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Post by pelican » Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:55 am

In an effort to try to clean up the overloaded `characters' tree a little, I present...

Fetishes
  • Cat girls
  • Cosplay
  • Domination
  • Elves
  • Futanari
  • Hamsters
  • Maids
  • Nuns
  • Nurses
  • Teachers
  • Tentacles
  • Vampires
  • Waitresses

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sjabbie
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Post by sjabbie » Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:52 am

Vampires a fetish? Don't know about that.

And some of the fetishes can be put under cosplay, like nuns, maids, nurses, waitresses, and cat girls.

yidaki
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Post by yidaki » Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:29 am

I was thinking, as there is
Genre - sci-fi - mecha - transformation
I think there should be
Genre - sci-fi - mecha - combination
aswell.

You know, like gattai mechas.
Transformers transform, from a car to a mecha.
Getter Robo combine, from three airplanes to different robots.

Actually, Transformers can do both, transform from car to mecha and then combine to a larger mecha.

Just thought it could prove useful, considering that mechas like Mazinger and Evangelion don't combine at all.
It's usually mentioned as a landmark in mecha-history, that Go Nagai made the first transforming mechas :)

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Elias
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Post by Elias » Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:33 am

pelican wrote:In an effort to try to clean up the overloaded `characters' tree a little, I present...

Fetishes
  • Cat girls
  • Cosplay
  • Domination
  • Elves
  • Futanari
  • Hamsters
  • Maids
  • Nuns
  • Nurses
  • Teachers
  • Tentacles
  • Vampires
  • Waitresses
Cosplay, Domination as characters? Maids, nuns, nurses, waitresses and teachers as fetishes, not normal professions? And hamsters as fetishes? Hamsters???
I think you should try rather extend Genre:Hentai tree - there is proper place for fetishes (and maybe also watch some not-hentai animes with normal working, not cosplaying maids, waitresses, nurses or even 'normal' cat girls 8) ).
yidaki wrote:I was thinking, as there is
Genre - sci-fi - mecha - transformation
I think there should be
Genre - sci-fi - mecha - combination
aswell.
Agreed. Examples of mecha combination only (tranformation takes place only in process of combination):
Vandread, Sousei no Aquarion

pelican
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Post by pelican » Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:51 pm

Elias wrote:
pelican wrote:In an effort to try to clean up the overloaded `characters' tree a little, I present...

Fetishes
  • Cat girls
  • Cosplay
  • Domination
  • Elves
  • Futanari
  • Hamsters
  • Maids
  • Nuns
  • Nurses
  • Teachers
  • Tentacles
  • Vampires
  • Waitresses
Cosplay, Domination as characters? Maids, nuns, nurses, waitresses and teachers as fetishes, not normal professions? And hamsters as fetishes? Hamsters???
"Hamsters" was a joke, but the rest isn't. And as professions they aren't useful categories, but as fetishes they are.
I think you should try rather extend Genre:Hentai tree - there is proper place for fetishes
Strangely enough, the proper place is under "fetishes". Am I the only one who wants to call a spade a gardening tool? And I didn't place "fetishes" under hentai because it's far more widely spread, into ecchi and far beyond into fairly `normal' anime.

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sjabbie
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Post by sjabbie » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:32 pm

I think there should be two fetishes trees. One for hentai and one for the normal anime.

Domination sounds a little SM like, so that should fall under hentai.

The cosplay like fetishes should fall under all anime.

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Elias
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Post by Elias » Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:54 pm

pelican wrote:
Elias wrote:
pelican wrote:In an effort to try to clean up the overloaded `characters' tree a little, I present...

Fetishes
  • Cat girls
  • Cosplay
  • Domination
  • Elves
  • Futanari
  • Hamsters
  • Maids
  • Nuns
  • Nurses
  • Teachers
  • Tentacles
  • Vampires
  • Waitresses
Cosplay, Domination as characters? Maids, nuns, nurses, waitresses and teachers as fetishes, not normal professions? And hamsters as fetishes? Hamsters???
"Hamsters" was a joke, but the rest isn't. And as professions they aren't useful categories, but as fetishes they are.
Not useful? Examples of non-fetishes, non-hentai titles having such characters:
Teachers: Onegai Teacher, GTO
Nurses: Amazing Nurse Nanako
Maids: Hanaukyo Maids, Mahoromatic, My Maid Mai, Very Private Lesson,
Waitresses: Pia Carrot 2 DX, Kimi ga Nozomu Eien
Cat girls: Dominion Tank Police, Hyper Police
...

Cosplay itself is a nice idea (Genre::Ecchi::Cosplay ?) and some of those fetishes can be added under Genre::hentai, but don't mess them with different genres. If someone has a scene or two cosplaying as nurse its not the same as if someone works as a nurse. When you would wear maid or nurse uniform it would be a fetish, but when maid wear maid's uniform its just her job.

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