Why do you use ANN links if their info is unreliable?
I sent in a CREQ for Damekko Doubutsu
http://anidb.info/perl-bin/animedb.pl?s ... e&aid=2824
because on AnimeNewsNetwork it said it would be 26 episodes so that's the change in the CREQ.
(ANN Link = http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclo ... hp?id=4994)
and 'rar' returned me a message back
'20.03.05 10:23 rar (15147) Message Added:
look @ how unreliable their second-hand reporting is.
...I guess I`ll poke around for a proper source. '
if it's so damn unreliable don't use it.
Why do you use ANN links if their info is unreliable?
Moderator: AniDB
Ugh... I new I'd have about a billion things to respond to when I went through the forum again... well, better now than later when next essay is due.
ANN is useful as an easily accessable and moderately comprehensive source. However the problem with using it as an exlusive source for information is that it's entirely second-hand, user submitted information, and has traditionally been poorly moderated. I mean, I'd look at wiki if I wanted to know the date of some historical event, but you can be damn sure I'd check somewhere else before stating that in a marked assignment.
Hence the comment. Sure, it's perfectly likely that it might be 26 eps, but I'm not going to state that without checking elsewhere. The internet has a funny chinese whispers effect, speculation being filtered into fact through sites copying each others data. If enough sites say something, it has to be true right?
As for ep-number requests in general, I think I've said before that it's very difficult to be right about it, even *after* the last ep has finished. I've denied about ten very 'sensible' requests, and I think in every case the number has turned out differently. The fact is that the financing on anime shows is so knife edge, even *if* the producers have a specific number of episodes in mind, bad ratings, or one of a myriad of other circumstances, might mean a shorter run.
Now, for future reference, as non-mods don't have access to the creq history, here's a few examples (dammit, I want tables... bbcode sucks) of eps creqs and resolution:
Jinki:Extend
User.......Eps......Source......Resolution
suppy......13......animenfo......revoked
dwd.........13.....animesuki......denied
himmel....12.....cal.syoboi.jp...granted
I strongly suspect there will be a 13th ep released on the dvd, this seems to be a trend of late.
Gallery Fake
hhaamu....13....cal.syoboi.jp.....granted
hhaamu....0....cal.syoboi.jp.....granted
So, looked from the scheduals like it'd be 13 eps... and then it didn't any more. Current bet is at least 26... we'll see.
Suki na Mono wa Suki Dakara Shou ga nai!!
kouta61801...26....???............revoked
aussie.....13.....sukisyo.tv???....ignore-granted
gknight....12....sukisyo.tv.....granted
Again, I bet we're talking dvd extra ep here.
A few other fun ones:
Mai Hime
imokie.....13.....animenfo.......granted
litghost.....24....animeondvd...granted
sujin.........26.....ANN+animesuki...granted
Juuni Kokuki
...this one is too long to list, and indeed partly predates the current creq system. Ping-ponged between 45 and 68 eps quite happily for a very long time.
Er... well, I've been and had dinner since I started this post, and have now forgotten where I was heading. So, hit Submit time.
Rar
ANN is useful as an easily accessable and moderately comprehensive source. However the problem with using it as an exlusive source for information is that it's entirely second-hand, user submitted information, and has traditionally been poorly moderated. I mean, I'd look at wiki if I wanted to know the date of some historical event, but you can be damn sure I'd check somewhere else before stating that in a marked assignment.
Hence the comment. Sure, it's perfectly likely that it might be 26 eps, but I'm not going to state that without checking elsewhere. The internet has a funny chinese whispers effect, speculation being filtered into fact through sites copying each others data. If enough sites say something, it has to be true right?
As for ep-number requests in general, I think I've said before that it's very difficult to be right about it, even *after* the last ep has finished. I've denied about ten very 'sensible' requests, and I think in every case the number has turned out differently. The fact is that the financing on anime shows is so knife edge, even *if* the producers have a specific number of episodes in mind, bad ratings, or one of a myriad of other circumstances, might mean a shorter run.
Now, for future reference, as non-mods don't have access to the creq history, here's a few examples (dammit, I want tables... bbcode sucks) of eps creqs and resolution:
Jinki:Extend
User.......Eps......Source......Resolution
suppy......13......animenfo......revoked
dwd.........13.....animesuki......denied
himmel....12.....cal.syoboi.jp...granted
I strongly suspect there will be a 13th ep released on the dvd, this seems to be a trend of late.
Gallery Fake
hhaamu....13....cal.syoboi.jp.....granted
hhaamu....0....cal.syoboi.jp.....granted
So, looked from the scheduals like it'd be 13 eps... and then it didn't any more. Current bet is at least 26... we'll see.
Suki na Mono wa Suki Dakara Shou ga nai!!
kouta61801...26....???............revoked
aussie.....13.....sukisyo.tv???....ignore-granted
gknight....12....sukisyo.tv.....granted
Again, I bet we're talking dvd extra ep here.
A few other fun ones:
Mai Hime
imokie.....13.....animenfo.......granted
litghost.....24....animeondvd...granted
sujin.........26.....ANN+animesuki...granted
Juuni Kokuki
...this one is too long to list, and indeed partly predates the current creq system. Ping-ponged between 45 and 68 eps quite happily for a very long time.
Er... well, I've been and had dinner since I started this post, and have now forgotten where I was heading. So, hit Submit time.
Rar
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DonGato
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The problem is that you want something definitive and that even the producer can't say for sure. JK is the perfect example. It was denied a couple of times the request for reduction to 45 episodes by Wlah (IIRC). Well, guess what, it was 45 episodes after all, but people still think that the promise of extending the series is enough justification to hold the 68 value. -_-;
We can use the official "guessed" values or just wait the series to finish or maybe even not.
We can use the official "guessed" values or just wait the series to finish or maybe even not.
If you only accept change requests based on the original Japanese source, I'm guessing people will enter a lot less change requests. I and many others don't know any Japanese so we mostly can't enter a change request based on the official site.
But most AniDB mods think ANN is a reliable enough source the grant change requests. I've entered several change requests with ANN as source. The only mod that didn't think ANN was good enough as source (and wanted a primairy source) has been rar so far (although that particular change request was still granted).
If it is truly so that only official sites (in Japanese) are good enough as source for change requests, I think a note about this should be added to the change request pages. But personally I think ANN as source should be good enough, especially if the change request is submitted to add additional information and not to change already existing information.
But most AniDB mods think ANN is a reliable enough source the grant change requests. I've entered several change requests with ANN as source. The only mod that didn't think ANN was good enough as source (and wanted a primairy source) has been rar so far (although that particular change request was still granted).
If it is truly so that only official sites (in Japanese) are good enough as source for change requests, I think a note about this should be added to the change request pages. But personally I think ANN as source should be good enough, especially if the change request is submitted to add additional information and not to change already existing information.
Imokie, this is an issue with only a small number of ANN change requests, certainly most fill-in-the-blanks creqs get granted without a second glance. We trust ANN users to be able to data entry as well as anidb users, errors there will be picked up by others and creqed again.
My only issue is with the 'speculative data' side of things. ANN was originally a news site, and a fair bit of its content is still scavenged from blogs, japanese news and rumour sites, which is great for a news purpose, as these tend to have the very latest info. The problem comes when we copy this into a database context - which purports to present facts, not speculation. Neither anidb or the database part of ANN gives the source for any of their data to the user, nor an indication of its reliabilty. So the problem is less the data itself, and more the transferal of its presentation via internet-whispers.
In any case, while description and copy-off-the-credits type info creqs will tend to be granted first glance from many sources, I personally try and find a slightly 'cleaner' source when dealing with prospective happenings, such as future releases and number-of-eps. The '0 eps' line should really serve fine for most entries until the last ep is actually in the scheduals. At any rate, I see this as a largely academic issue, users shouldn't panic and revoke a request just because I say I'm looking for confirmation on it.
Rar
My only issue is with the 'speculative data' side of things. ANN was originally a news site, and a fair bit of its content is still scavenged from blogs, japanese news and rumour sites, which is great for a news purpose, as these tend to have the very latest info. The problem comes when we copy this into a database context - which purports to present facts, not speculation. Neither anidb or the database part of ANN gives the source for any of their data to the user, nor an indication of its reliabilty. So the problem is less the data itself, and more the transferal of its presentation via internet-whispers.
In any case, while description and copy-off-the-credits type info creqs will tend to be granted first glance from many sources, I personally try and find a slightly 'cleaner' source when dealing with prospective happenings, such as future releases and number-of-eps. The '0 eps' line should really serve fine for most entries until the last ep is actually in the scheduals. At any rate, I see this as a largely academic issue, users shouldn't panic and revoke a request just because I say I'm looking for confirmation on it.
Rar